April 19th, 2015 
AstroNerdBoy Fate/stay night: Unlimited Blade Works – 15 review
フェイト/ステイナイト [Unlimited Blade Works] – 15
SPOILER Summary/Synopsis:
The blonde Spirit managed to “slay” Berserker, leading Shinji to celebrate. However, Berserker comes back to life. However, Berserker doesn’t go on the offensive against his opponent, rather choosing a defensive stand to protect Ilya. As the battle rages, Shirou and Rin make their way to the castle while Ilya thinks back to when she was younger and awaited the return of her father, Kiritsugu, who never came. She was apparently abandoned by her grandfather and tormented by the evil that took the form of her mother, Iri.
Sometime later, it is clear that Ilya is being modified and in the process, discovers that homunculi are being created and slaughtered for the Einzbern greater purpose.Some years later, Ilya is assigned the new homunculi servants Sella and Liz, whom she cares little for. Berserker has been summoned and is bound, so Ilya attempts to use her massive magic circuits to break him. Sometime later, she’s tossed into the snowy woods and forced to make it to the castle in order to travel to Fuyuki, Japan. She’s attacked by wolves when Berserker comes to save her of his own free will. Now that she understands him, the two work well together.
Back in the present, Rin and Shirou quietly observe the fight. Berserker is down to his last life and is told by the blonde Servant that if he abandons Ilya, he’d have a chance to win. Berserker refuses to do this and is apparently slain. However, he returns to life, only to be bound by the Chains of Heaven, which prevents Ilya’s Command Spell to have Berserker return to her overridden. Berserker is again “slain” as the blonde Servant summons a small sword, putting out Ilya’s eyes. Blinded, she tries to find Berserker and is stabbed in the chest. Falling to the ground, Ilya manages to touch Berserker and is comforted. The blonde Servant is about to kill her when Berserker breaks free and nearly reaches him, but three additional weapons from Blondie stop Berserker inches short. Shirou has had enough and reveals himself, getting a sword attack as a result as Ilya dies.
Thoughts/Review:
Gah! I knew things would not go well, but man, I didn’t think things would go this badly.
Because Ilya is the Grail, I thought Blondie would capture her. I was prepared for him to harm her in some way to disarm her, but I didn’t think he’d slay her. I’ve no idea how this will affect the Grail and such.
Of course the way Blondie puts out Ilya’s eyes before stabbing her is done in a way to really induce rage on the part of the viewer. He didn’t even take a scratch in his fight with Berserker, so one hopes that down the road, he really takes a massive beating and a half.
Having Ilya’s tragic past explored helped add to the melodrama of the moment when Ilya is killed. Although there was a lot of stuff there, it felt very compressed to me. I’m guessing that this black goop with red in it that took the form of Iri was the corrupted Grail, but I didn’t understand how it was appearing to her.
I didn’t understand why Ilya was alone and apparently freezing in her room, then later, she was all bloodied and bandaged.
I didn’t understand what all of the homunculi that were being slaughtered and disposed of where doing as part of whatever scheme the Einzbern were doing.
I was disappointed we didn’t see Berserker being summoned. I know from other people telling me that he was summoned early, and one gets that impression from seeing how he’s there, yet Ilya’s trip to Japan is still some time away.
I liked seeing how Berserker and Ilya bonded. Berserker was Ilya’s best friend after she understood him. I’d never really seen Berserker in a sympathetic light until this episode.
I guess it was Ilya bonding with Berserker that caused her to become more friendly with Sella and Liz, to whom she was so cold to in the beginning. It was nice seeing the pair of them again.
Finally, there was Shirou letting his emotions get the best of him. I remember in the original Fate/stay night anime, such antics by Shirou would irritate me. Here, having witnessed Blondie’s brutality against Ilya made Shirou’s rage understandable because I was feeling the same way. We’ll see what becomes of him next week.
I subtitled my review “to kill a mockingbird” because this episode made it clear that Ilya was an innocent, half-human/half-homunculus being who had been brutalized since the end of the events in Fate/Zero. Having seen the first anime, I know she would have had a good life after the war. Now, she’s been slain by Blondie, who so needs to receive a tortured death because of his actions.
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It’s quite convenient that we get another season of Fate Kaleid Prisma Illya the season after this one. I think it’ll help ease the pain on the bad things happening to Illya and the maids.
Given what we know about Illya now, I get the feeling that she [spoiler]still remembers the good things about her father, even if she hates him and wanted to kill him. She mentions Berserker is like her father, or rather the good things about him that she remembers.[/spoiler]
On another note about the relationship of Illya and Shirou.
[spoiler]It was kind of cute for her to think about Shirou as her little brother. You’ve already seen in Fate route anime that after Berserker dies she clings more to him than before. That’s also why I like the relationship in Fate Kaleid, where they’re really a happy family ^_^[/spoiler]
You said it! Egad! I’ve never been so thankful to go back to a series where Ilya, Sella, and Liz are alive and kicking.
I agree with that spoiler block.
I don’t think Shirou learns that Ilya is his sister in the VN until the Heaven’s Feel route.
This episode is mostly based on the chapters VS Berserker and Winter Forest, with several new scenes, especially in the flashback.
While the fight mostly plays out the same, the flashback was extended, so I’ll start with that part first.
To sum up what is said in the novel:
[spoiler title="VN details"]
[Note: The reason some of this is not shown in the anime is probably because for now it’s irrelevant info and because Shirou will learn about this in Heaven’s Feel.]
The flashback begins with some history about the Einzberns. How they have searched for the Holy Grail for a thousand years,how they were finally able to create its vessel, but couldn’t prepare the content, and so had to let in outsiders. It also tells how they kept breaking the rules of the Grail War.
They broke the rules and constantly pulled out the strongest card.
In the first one, they did not have time to do such a thing.
In the second one, they finally found a loophole in the rules.
In the third one, they summoned what they shouldn’t have.
And in the fourth one…
They were sure of their victory, having the strongest card and its master.
[Then some info about the outsider they let in, who betrayed them in the end, etc. Basically without naming him, Kiritsugu was revealed to be the Einzbern Master in this chapter.]
Anyway, Ilya was their insurance and Berserker, due to lots of broken rules again, was summoned two months before the Grail War even began. However, since Berserker didn’t rely on the energy of the Holy Grail, but solely on the Command Spell and the mana of his Master, it caused his Master great amounts of pain. It only lessened, when the Grail started to appear.
The narrator then jumps to the “final test” that was shown in the anime, with Berserker defending Ilya from the wolves in the forest and all that. That scene was basically a 1:1 adaptation. Then at the end of the flashback, Berserker realizes how Ilya’s insults only hide her weakness, how he’s the only one she is talking to. He realizes her loneliness.
Later on, when Berserker dies, it’s revealed how Berserker scared her, but was really kind and how his big body reminded her of her father etc. Basically like in the anime.[/spoiler]
So, what was new? Well, basically, additional things that were revealed in this flashback and in HF were shown here, but with far more details. Ilya’s loneliness was mentioned in the VN in the flashback, but here it’s far more detailed. It’s known that the Einzberns manipulated and brainwashed Ilya. This is what we see in the flashback basically, I believe, because otherwise, I have almost no idea what Dark Iri is doing here.
First things first. I wouldn’t find it weird, if Ilya saw the “normal” Iri. Something similar happens at the end of Fate/Zero and is also mentioned in Fate/hollow ataraxia (http://imgur.com/dMcmUuO,ISNbyzf,DTxtrQ7)
Ilya always has a connection to her mother. It doesn’t matter if Iri died or not, Ilya can still talk to Iri if she wants to. It’s kind of hard to explain why, but it is because of the connection between Ilya/Iri and their base model, Archmagus Justeaze von Einzbern, the Lady of
Winter. Homunculi based on the same model share memories. Einzbern homunculi have genetic memories of their older models, if you will.
(I can’t really say who Justeaze is, cause that would be a spoiler for Heaven’s Feel, but her name was dropped in the last episode of Fate/Zero.)
Anyway, that whole “Dark Iri” scene is a bit strange. It shows scenes from the time Kiritsugu was inside the Holy Grail. That “Iri” was Iri, but not really Iri, so Ilya seeing these memories seems weird to me. It’s hard to say how much of it is the Einzberns’ manipulation and how much are truly memories that she has seen.
The way I interpret it, it’s mostly the Einzbern’s method to brainwash Ilya. All that they are saying, that Kiritsugu betrayed them, that he left Ilya behind and stayed in Japan with his new “son”, Ilya’s little brother… these are all half-truths to fuel Ilya’s hatred and manipulate her. When Ilya says it’s all lies, we don’t see Iri again, we see Jubstacheit/Acht (http://i.imgur.com/j3mK1C8.jpg), head of the Einzberns, who hired Kiritsugu. This is why I assume Dark Iri is just Ilya’s imagination, perhaps mixed with snippets of memories that she saw.
He is called Acht because acht is the German word for eight, and he is the eighth head of the family. Acht wasn’t there when the Holy Grail of Fuyuki was created, but he is over 200 years old and has been present since the Second War. (I don’t think he is a homunculus. His eyes for instance aren’t red.)
Is she really freezing or is she just afraid? It’s hard to tell, but I think it’s the latter. Ilya is isolated, she wants to see her father again, who is detested by the Einzberns and loathed as a traitor. As for being bloodied and bandaged, that’s probably Ilya getting modified by the Einzberns, to prepare her for the Grail War. Her body, as she said herself, was opened up numerous times and who knows what they did to her. This is why Kiritsugu wanted to get her out. He knew what the Einzberns would do to her.
Failures, all of them. Homunculi who aren’t strong enough for their purpose, presumably. I know it’s been a while, but there is that scene from Fate/Zero, where Irisviel sees a bunch of discarded homunculi. These were all her predecessors, which failed their “tests”. Irisviel was finally the one who managed to survive.
http://i.imgur.com/25dXUb6.jpg
Liz is also called a failure by Ilya, but… well, she’s different.
The scene with the discarded homunculi, who interacted with Ilya, also reeks of manipulation in my opinion. Yes, Ilya is perhaps the greatest Master they ever created, but giving up their thousand year old dream if Ilya loses? No way.
The Einzberns are stubborn magi, whose only purpose is getting back the True Magic they lost. If they fail again, they would just cheat even more than they already did, is what I think. However, calling the Einzberns a “factory” is perhaps a very fitting word. They are more machine than living beings. Ilya meeting Sella and Liz and interacting with Berserker for the first time were also nice additions.
This is also the first time in this adaptation, where we see Ilya’s magic circuit/Command Spell:
VN: http://i.imgur.com/MoqDcmb.jpg
ufo: http://i.imgur.com/InaHQvR.jpg
It covers her whole body and is always shown when she generates mana. It’s only because of this Command Spell that she is able to fully control Berserker, which normally is impossible. Ilya has such amazing circuits, they basically function as infinite Command Spells.
Ah, and it seems like God Hand has to be activated first. Otherwise I have no idea why these wolves can hurt Berserker. A-Rank wolves? lol. Then again, this would kind of make sense, because we all know Ilya can defend herself (I doubt she learned her offensive spells after that whole incident). Though the general interpretation is that he deactivated God Hand and Mad Enhancement because it hurt Ilya.
What that flashback also makes clear is that Berserker, who, even mad, still has a sense of reason. He protects Ilya out of his own will. As I’ve said before, he is used to become mad, it doesn’t affect him as badly as FZ-Berserker for instance.
Perhaps he views Ilya as a daughter-like figure, just as Ilya wishes Berserker to be a father figure to her. This actually makes sense, considering what Heracles did with his family, when Hera caused him to go mad. Looking after a child and protect her like his own would certainly fit.
Also, that one shot of Berserker and Ilya is based again on a CG from the VN.
VN: http://i.imgur.com/vXOC4x5.jpg
ufo: http://i.imgur.com/nRxcHHn.jpg
Btw, Irisviel was also thrown into the forest, to “test” her. Kiritsugu saved her life, though.
For sure, this flashback-before-death seems standard and stereotypical (mangas like Bleach, One Piece and Naruto did that frequently), but, just like last week with Sella and Liz, this flashback and Ilya’s mutilation would surely affect the viewer more, if he or she already knows Ilya better.
In the novel it was more heartwrenching, because the reader already knew Ilya from the Fate route, but I guess Fate/Zero (she doesn’t appear that much, though) or Prisma Illya also work. Still, this scene isn’t as powerful for a new viewer. Minus points because I thought it oddly placed in the novel and if this anime is also supposed to work as a standalone, it’s in my opinion even worse, but I guess ufotable made the best of it. They wanted to stay faithful to the novel.
————————————————————————————————————————————–
Now about the fight between Berserker against the blonde Servant (still not name-dropped, dammit). One of the additions was how Blondie figured out Berserker’s Noble Phantasm, as an explanation from the Fate route is missing. His first attacks are shrugged off by God Hand, but Berserker starts parrying, once Blondie shoots an A-Rank NP at him. He then starts launching only A-Rank NPs at Berserker, which kill him every time.
God Hand’s ability to gain resistances is useless, as Blondie shoots one different NP after another. He forces Berserker to tank them (instead of dodging them, remember, he is hella quick), by attacking Ilya.
Finally, Blondie uses Enkidu, the Chains of Heaven, the anti-God NP. It is a normal, but tough chain, and it gets stronger the more divine the target is. A demi-god like Berserker, whose divinity is A-Rank, is usually screwed, but still, just as Heracles was able to break Prometheus’ adamantine chain in the legend, Berserker overcomes Enkidu with his sheer strength and willpower, when Blondie starts mutilating Ilya, which surprises even Blondie. His tenacity surprises Blondie in the novel, too.
Berserker manages to live on for a while (which is, in gaming terms, translated as a skill named Battle Continuation (http://i.imgur.com/cSZgo4s.jpg)), but it’s not enough. In the novel, he breaks the chains, then is stopped by a spear (which looks like Gae Bolg). However, he keeps on living with his will and maintains his body, until the blind Ilya finds him and says her final words, which eases her mind as she slowly dies.
What has also changed is Shirou’s and Rin’s positions. They actually split up, Rin is not with him, but on the other side, in the novel. Minor change which doesn’t really lead to a different situation. Shirou still jumps out and yells at Blondie to stop, despite knowing that confronting that Servant will mean he will die. He doesn’t care about his own safetey, he just wants to stop that Servant.
In that regard, portraying his idiocy is correct, but his reasoning is missing, which makes him less sympathetic. Will probably resolved next episode, though, I hope. Still, it portrays better how Rin is the force that holds him back from doing something stupid.
Additional notes:
1. Episode script:
http://i.imgur.com/qWjq8Vn.jpg
2. As I’ve mentioned two weeks ago, there would be a special ED. It’s a rearrangement of Kalafina’s ring your bell called ring your bell (in the silence). It really gives a Kara no Kyoukai-like feeling.
3. Ilya’s seiyuu, Mai Kadowaki, reportedly cried at the prescreening in Japan, after this episode aired. The official twitter accounts of Prisma Illya and Hiroyama Hiroshi (the mangaka) also reacted to this episode:
https://twitter.com/hiroshi_/status/589456155392376832 & https://twitter.com/prisma_illya/status/589449955145752576
See you again in Prisma Illya 2wei Herz, Ilya. T_T
4. Like last week regarding homunculi, Blondie speaks with more respect to Berserker in the anime than he does in the novel, in my opinion. He praises Heracles’ deeds and how he doesn’t possess a Noble Phantasm like God Hand. Perhaps another change, to make Blondie less like a douche.
5. https://twitter.com/hikaruufo/status/589450315826536449
The episode was modified for the tv broadcasting. I think some scenes were left out again (not sure), but it was definitely censored. Someone who visited the prescreening noted how they explicitly showed how Blondie slashed Ilya’s eyes for instance.
6. Shirou already read the stats of this unknown Servant. He also recognized some of the weapons that were used, like Durandal, Dainsleif, Vajra, Harpe (not Herpe) and Houtengeki.
[spoiler title="Stats and Weapon screens"]
Servant stats and NP:
http://i.imgur.com/hAZd4T8.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/HXigbgH.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/3aBi9EJ.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/uNbKkzq.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/GwPIdTH.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/OeFWMZu.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/oth3jDZ.jpg
[/spoiler]
7. Gif overload:
[spoiler title="GIFs"]
Flashback:
“Kiritsugu’s back!” :
http://i.imgur.com/GJX5ztT.gif
Ilya welcoming home…:
http://i.imgur.com/g5ZFNKl.gif
Ilya circuit activation:
http://i.imgur.com/Ya07i0y.gif
Ilya punch:
http://i.imgur.com/SZplIws.gif
Berserker’s Mad Enhancement activation:
http://i.imgur.com/n5OKy4a.gif
Protecting Ilya:
http://i.imgur.com/z4frq7v.gif
Heracles powerup:
http://i.imgur.com/UnTW00Z.gif
Winter Forest, “You’re strong, Berserker.”:
http://i.imgur.com/kR86GWf.gif
Winter Forest, walking home:
http://i.imgur.com/zTPG317.gif
———————————————-
Slow-motion Ilya:
http://i.imgur.com/2ov0Rr8.gif
More Mad Enhancement:
http://i.imgur.com/PQCJlmp.gif
Gate of Babylon vs Heracles:
http://i.imgur.com/VvoKnuE.gif
http://i.imgur.com/GN1Sel9.gif
http://i.imgur.com/0SVxG8w.gif
http://i.imgur.com/Pg3v0bF.gif
http://i.imgur.com/B5miIvz.gif
http://i.imgur.com/NlTVl7V.gif
http://i.imgur.com/YH3IYLO.gif
http://i.imgur.com/9N5TIfe.gif
http://i.imgur.com/vpq9SZ5.gif
http://i.imgur.com/4UmIzM9.gif
Berserker revivals:
http://i.imgur.com/FCUjIGg.gif
http://i.imgur.com/FeDXkM6.gif
http://i.imgur.com/GN1Sel9.gif
Roaring Berserker:
http://i.imgur.com/gyoLlcf.gif
Evil-looking Blondie:
http://i.imgur.com/ZVcc9wf.gif
Enkidu:
http://i.imgur.com/Z59sCT8.gif
Heracles, Breaker of Chains:
http://i.imgur.com/S1DHjd3.gif
Brutal Blondie and bleeding Ilya:
http://i.imgur.com/EFCr2T7.gif
http://i.imgur.com/TwFJGGT.gif
http://i.imgur.com/1OjbxJg.gif
Does this remind you of anything?
Version 1:
http://i.imgur.com/47nb9JF.gif (480×270)
http://i.imgur.com/qudYzd2.gif (640×360)
http://i.imgur.com/oR75clo.gif (960×540)
Version 2:
http://i.imgur.com/orOTTRu.gif (480×270)
http://i.imgur.com/v8HveTc.gif (640×360)
http://i.imgur.com/98pnlby.gif (960×540)
Version 3:
http://i.imgur.com/9SIz8pN.gif (480×270)
http://i.imgur.com/BisjTDo.gif (640×360)
http://i.imgur.com/AxaQm7D.gif (960×540)
Brings back memories of this scene…:
http://i.imgur.com/ZKBBUgo.gif
Bonus loops:
Gate of Babylon:
http://i.imgur.com/Q0UDeZ0.gif
http://i.imgur.com/vBYykeo.gif
Invincible Heracles:
http://i.imgur.com/WQOKKK0.gif
[/spoiler]
Oh, forgot to mention this.
Unfortunately, I have to say that good life lasts only a year. Ilya does not live for long after the Grail War. Also,
[spoiler title="Coming UBW events"] she’s not dead yet. Only unconscious and slowly dying.[/spoiler]
I should note, I did notice Ilya’s breath, but I still think she is scared. What scares her is perhaps Dark Iri and the words she uses to “torture” Ilya.
I remember being told that, but I chose to think of them finding a way to keep her alive for a while longer. 😉 (Did I mention that this episode depressed the crap out of me? 😥 )
I don’t deny the fear aspect, but I think that room was physically cold to “make or break” Ilya.
[spoiler title="FZ spoilers"]Oh btw, I found it amusing how many FZ-only watchers claim FZ-Berserker put up a better fight. It’s like they blatantly ignore, Blondie never took FZ-Berserker seriously and played with him, while he even panicked for a moment when he fought Heracles.
The maximum amount of Noble Phantasms Blondie shot at Berserker in FZ was… 16, and not even at the same time. Here in this episode he shot how many…? And that he forced Heracles back by aiming at Ilya, yeah… Not to mention he used Enkidu, his greatest treasure. Greater than even his sword Ea, which he only deemed worthy against Excalibur and the Reality Marble, Ionian Hetairoi. [/spoiler]
Additional info about God Hand:
In a very early draft, God Hand worked differently. One idea was based on Nasu’s ideas of concepts. God Hand was a Noble Phantasm, which allowed Heracles to win 11 battles undefeated. This clashed with Blondie’s original NP concept to survive no matter what, which again led to a draw, with Heracles winning, but dying, and Blondie losing, but surviving.
There was also the initial design of Ilya and Heracles sharing a lifelink, which basically meant you can’t kill Ilya, as long as Berserker is alive. Since it was too overpowered, it was scrapped. This idea is still mentioned by Rin in the novel though, if I remember correctly.
Well, either way, God Hand still is based on a very specific concept. It still is an overpowered NP, and it needed another overpowered NP to defeat it.
Thanks for the additional info. ^_^ (I’m still depressed though.)
*sigh* You know, I’m still angry and depressed about what happened in this episode. Every time I see the featured image for this post, I just feel so “ugh.” 😥
Wow. So there was more added? I figured we may have seen less since things felt somewhat confusing to me at times.
Now that you mention this, it seems I do recall being told way back when that Ilya shared her mother’s memories.
That’s probably what ufotable was going for.
Her exhale formed condensation, leading me to think this is a cold room. Further, she was in rags with only a blanket in what has been shown to be a cold environment. And there was no fire in the fireplace. So while I’m sure there was fear, I got the sense they were trying to get her to survive physically too and preparing her for that last journey in the snow, where she wore the same rags as in this scene.
Poor wording on my part. I did get that they were doing terrible things to her, but I didn’t get the linkage from her being abandoned, cold, and frightened in a room to being operated on. I’m probably not making sense.
I’d forgotten that. However, in that case, they were looking to make Iri. In this case, Ilya was already made. I guess they were trying to make Sella and Liz.
Yeah, I noticed that.
Was that in Fate/Zero?
Or having watched the first anime adaptation. That’s what did it for me.
Of course being a bastard, Blondie noticed Berserker protecting Ilya, which is why he targeted her.
Amen to that, where she gets to have a better life.
If that was the reason, then they failed ’cause he’s the Grand Nozzle in my books. That being said, it felt proper for him to acknowledge Heracles as not being just some ordinary schlub.
I don’t need to see that. It was horrific enough KNOWING what he’d done to her.
Did I mention how depressed I feel? Man, I need a light comedy.
As always, thanks for the great info. ^_^
Yeah, physical tests were probably involved too, now that I think about it. I was more focused on psychologically breaking Ilya, with all that talk about her father and Iri. Too much focus on Iri.
In a way.
http://i.imgur.com/LY6WINv.jpg
That’s from Fate/Zero’s second ED. It tells the story of how Kiritsugu and Iri met. More details are on the drama cd that is included in the first BD box. Acht decided to “test” Irisviel’s durability, forcing Kiritsugu to go out to the forest and bring Iri back to the castle.
Well, that’s basically a version of Fate, so I kept that in mind. 😉
Hey, I said less, not completely gone. ^_^ He’s even more insulting and mocking in the novel, if I remember correctly.
You know, what happens next episode triggered a lot of jokes for the last ten years. I think GhostStalker started last week already, but you’ll notice what it was next week. Very black humor.
Try this one. 😉
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uvbaM-URygs
If I think about it, just knowing what was done to Ilya and the hints that there’s still horrible stuff to come still makes me ill. 🙁
Yeah, this series has got to move up in my list.
Yeah, I thought so. Acht appearing screamed of “brainwashing Ilya”, it looked to me like he was partially responsible for Dark Iri. That guy was a typical cold magus. Even before Ilya was born, she was modified by the Einzberns (which is one of the reasons why she doesn’t reach puberty), as both Kiritsugu in FZ and Kuro in 2wei recall.
Perhaps. Not really revealed, other than that they are failed experiments. Could be anything, really.
Hmmm. Interesting. I would have figured a specific plot reason would have been given. Oh well.
I should also note one more thing:
[spoiler]I did say the discarded homunculi talking to Ilya sounds like manipulation (and it definitely partially is) and that Acht is a cold-ass bastard, but there is always some truth hidden in everything that is said. The True Magic that they wish to get back is able to “bring humanity salvation”.
Heaven’s Feel is strong enough to fulfill this. Using it on humanity is a noble goal, though I’m not sure the remaining Einzbern magi still remember. Ilya’s conversation with the homunculi indicates they still do.
It’s kind of ironic how Kiritsugu sought a miracle to save the world, which is why he participated in the Grail War, yet it didn’t seem like he cared about the Einzberns’ goal. I don’t know if Kiritsugu understood what the Third Magic was capable of. In a way, Einzbern and Kiritsugu had the same intentions.
The Einzberns have no interest in the Root – unlike the Tohsaka or Emiya magi – they already obtained the power they needed, although they had lost it and tried everything to get it back for a thousand years.
Unfortunately, True Magic and Heaven’s Feel are not themes of this route, so further conversations will have to wait until the Heaven’s Feel route is animated. Or you read Fate/Apocrypha. [/spoiler]
Thanks for the info.
I can see you giving an indepth response which is interesting to read ^^;;
[spoiler]Personally for me, the mud Irisviel is Angra Maiyu the Avenger who currupted the grail. I mean in HA he took Shirou’s form, so it wouldnt be surprising if it took Irisviel form since she was the previous host and all, that carried the grail.
Though yeah, correct me if i’m wrong Farray (just not to harsh please >.<) Illya Grandfather sealed of the castle and prevented Kiritsugu from returning to the castle and retrieving his daughter. What ever was left of the grail was put into Illya so she can be the next vessel/host that carries it. The mud form of Irisviel is the corrupted grail and is Avenger who is basically extending its corruptive influence on Illyasviel right?[/spoiler]
Kiritsugu was still a loving father and everything and spent the last of his days trying to redeem himself for failing to destroy the grail, protecting his wife from his enemy and saving his daughter from a cruel fate.
@Astroboynerd well Irisviel was murdered by Kirie so, doesnt really matter if Illyasviel died… though Gil's method was cruel.
No the Irisviel this episode has nothing to do with AM.
AM does not even function outside grail wars.
That was just one of many ways Einzberns were manipulating Illya into snapping against person who abandoned her.
Please. Please, please, please. Tag your comments correctly, because this contains hollow ataraxia spoilers. And partially HF spoilers, too.
[spoiler]You are correct, the Iri that spoke with Kiritsugu was Angra Mainyu, who took Iri’s personality as his own. He basically was Iri, though of course it wasn’t the woman Kiritsugu married and gave birth to Ilya.[/spoiler]
This is not correct.
[spoiler title="Heaven's Feel"]Okay, it’s partially correct. Ilya’s “grandfather”, Jubstacheit, kept the boundary field intact. Kiritsugu would have had no problem breaking through… if his powers hadn’t been weakened and sealed by Angra Mainyu’s final curse.
What was left of the Grail vessel was put into someone to make another vessel, but it wasn’t Ilya. You’re talking about Sakura. Zouken put parts of the Grail that he found after Saber destroyed the vessel, into Sakura to make her into a Grail vessel. Unlike Ilya, who before she was even born, was prepared to become the vessel, Sakura is not perfectly modified to act as a Grail vessel. [/spoiler]
As for your theory. See, I actually took that into consideration here:
And then rejected this idea. The corrupted Grail should not, or better, cannot affect Ilya that much, because she is a perfect vessel. While the “Iri” that talked to Kiritsugu could be considered as Iri, it’s more of an identity that the corrupted Grail took. There should be no shared homunculi connection here.
[spoiler title="All three VN route spoilers"] Ilya is unaffected by Angra Mainyu in all three routes in the VN (well, she dies in UBW…). This basically means, there is no direct line between Ilya and Angra Mainyu.
Sakura, as the Black Grail, on the other hand had a connection. She was greatly influenced by him, to the point where she became his Master and made a contract with him. That’s how she became “Dark Sakura”. [/spoiler]
Makes a lot more sense thank you. Lol to this day I still don’t know how to spoiler etc xD…
Is it spoiler then /spoiler in brackets?
Yes. ^_^
Well, I understand why people mix things up here and there. Grail mechanics are complicated and this episode doesn’t really help much.
[spoiler title="HF"]I mean, how should people, who only know Fate, UBW and/or FZ completely understand what is going on in the “Dark Iri” scenes, if the mechanics are only fully revealed in HF, which should be experienced after UBW and isn’t even out yet?
There is that fact that Angra Mainyu should not have any real influence on the vessel, as long as the Lesser Grail (either Ilya or Sakura) isn’t active, as in, its activity starts once the vessel takes in the defeated Servants.
Angra Mainyu was able to influence Sakura that much because the parts Zouken put into her were parts of the corrupted Grail vessel. Ilya is a “pure” vessel. [/spoiler]
The scene can be interpreted in many ways, but I think it more likely that “Dark Iri” is just the result of corrupted memories (shared by homunculi system), Ilya’s mental instability and the Einzberns’ active brainwashing to make her hate her father and guilt-trip her into participating in the Grail War.
And yes, it’s [ spoiler] [ /spoiler] 🙂
It was the method more than anything. Still, Ilya looks like a child, even though she’s older than Shirou, so murdering someone that looks like a child is bad enough. Taking a sword to her eyes to blind her was doubling down. 😡
I think you mean Ilya here, not Iri.
And yeah, this episode was brutal. Will say that it could’ve been a lot worse, as there’s something that a lot of us familiar with the VN expected to happen this week, but I guess will be in the first part of next week instead. Doctor Gil is not yet in the house, and I don’t think my heart could take it if he was here this week…
Not much more to say here, but I do have some gifs to share. A bunch of the ones I saw this week were watermarked, so I’m not posting them.
[spoiler]Ilya in a more innocent time:
https://38.media.tumblr.com/b48f07f1d9e0dfa83944bed61cedfc55/tumblr_nn0xh8a8tJ1rs5gxyo1_500.gif
Rin subduing Shirou:
http://i.imgur.com/WO3Rtrb.gif
Gil v Ilya:
https://38.media.tumblr.com/ee5aa435f127e96e1fc7ff196b7a9858/tumblr_nn0l8h8j1p1qcsnnso1_500.gif
Gate of Babylon:
http://33.media.tumblr.com/9c4ef9080ce682692fd0a6f501c37a09/tumblr_nn0l8h8j1p1qcsnnso2_500.gif
Berzerker reanimating:
http://33.media.tumblr.com/8ff3bbb8ddb389dc2304309305cc37ef/tumblr_nn0og9JHW31sl72dxo1_500.gif
There was also a set of gifs involving Gil doing his thing to Ilya, but I don’t think my heart could take seeing them again…[/spoiler]
Dagnabit! I hate when I do that. Thanks for the correction. ^_^
After seeing something Farray said, I have a very bad feeling about this. Ugh. I feel sick.
Got to tell ya – thats my general reaction to just reading your recaps of these series for the last few years. Well, not your recaps but their content, obviously! I only ever saw the first anime series, years ago, and the first few episodes of UBW and I got to ask: how are some intriguing setups and a handful of interesting characters enough to get you through the systematic torture and destruction of everything worthwhile, including those initial things? Because more than anything, that seems to be the dominant element of this universe that I keep hearing from every single post and comment about this .. this.. thing! Everybody gets tortured, raped, brainwashed, maimed, killed – especially the innocents! What’s the upside?
The end to this madness of the Holy Grail War. My understanding is that the positive end of all three routes results in this.
I know it can and should be taken in a more positive light, but this reminds me of a crack I’ve made elsewhen – “The best part about [Story] was when it ended.” (^_^);
Heh! Well, while there were sad parts in the Fate route told in the original FSN anime, for the most part, everything ended cool. There’s no doubt that the UBW route is much darker, but I do know that there will be a good end. So I guess that’s ultimately the point.
And while this is a darker anime, it is still a good story.
Just a quick note – I really need to stop being so negative. (^_^); I don’t want to give the wrong impression that I think Fate/* is a horrible series family (or that I think you feel that way about it). Far from it. The question and response just happened to strike a chord that reminded me of having made the above crack in the past about other stories.
Despite how depressing the last episode was, as I was telling a coworker who’s also watching the new series: I think an episode like the last one is the mark of a really good storyteller. If they can make you feel X way about a character, ingrain that into you, convince you that’s all there is to them… then believably turn your feelings toward them 180 degrees, without you consciously recognizing that’s what they’re doing… that shows incredible skill. In one episode they managed to do that with two characters, one of which had been hardly recognizable as a character before.
I agree.
And I didn’t have a wrong impression. ^_^
There are some good references to that castle if you recall f/z. The garden last episode, and the main hallway. I think reusability of locations is great because you start being familiar with the settings in a new light.
BTW notice the dialogue between Sella and leyz and Illya. After some time they did thaw out their relationship, enough that Illya cared for their wellbeing.
Yeah, I did recognize some things last episode. I think the horror of this episode kinda pushed all that aside for me. 🙁
I figured Ilya coming to understand Berserker caused her to come to understand her maids too.
That was not “evil taking form of Illya’s mother”.
The anime does not make it very clear but that was pretty much the old dude(the head of Einzbern Family) you see in the first flashback this episode, brainwashing Illya and making her see things that are not there.
It will be expanded upon in Heaven’s Feel.
OK. Thanks for the info. ^_^
Even though we’re still in April, we already have one good candidate for the title of “As***le of the Year – 2015”. DIO, you won’t win this match easily.
Har! That’s true.